Pop quiz

Alex Ross gives a comprehensive listing of NY Phil music conductors and their ages at the time they assumed the helm.  He links to Terry Teachout's blog, which prompts: "(Pop quiz: name five indisputably major under-sixty conductors. Hello? Is anybody there?)"  Alex says "there never have been indisputably major conductors under the age of fifty. Disputation surrounds all conductors until they advance to an invincible old age."

I hate to say it, but I think Alex is dead wrong (perhaps he's mistaking "indisputably major" with "indisputably great").  Here are some conductors, past and present, who I think achieved "indisputably major" status before the age of 55 (I'll split the age criteria set forth by Alex and Terry):

• Felix Mendelssohn, from all apparent reports he was pretty phenomenal by the time he reached his last, 39th birthday
• Gustav Mahler, who didn't quite make it to 51
• Guido Cantelli, dead at age 36
• David Robertson, age 49 today (Happy Birthday!)
• Christian Thielemann, age 48 (yes, he gets some pretty damning reviews performance-wise, but if you look at his resume, I'd say he's "indisputably major")
• Antonio Pappano, age 47

I'd also add Eduard van Beinum and Dmitri Mitropoulos to the list - they lived past the 55 year mark, but were indisputably major before then...

I'm excited about the New York Philharmonic taking a bit of a risk on someone young and extremely interested in living composers.  I think he will be balanced out by the rather substantial roll it seems that Riccardo Muti will be playing in the coming years. 

Also, to Terry, if you think "The New York Philharmonic has the oldest-looking audience of any major performing-arts organization whose performances I've attended in recent years", come on down and go to a Houston Symphony concert....

Comments

[Alex Ross]

Good to see you back, Marcus! I think the reputations of many of these conductors were heavily disputed in their lifetime. (That's how I am interpreting "indisputably" — no creditable opposition.) Mahler furiously divided critics and listeners right to the end. Mendelssohn as conductor drew criticism not just from the anti-Semitic Wagner but also from Berlioz ("He loves the dead too much"). Robertson and Thielemann have various detractors today. I'm not sure if anyone seriously opposed Cantelli, but did he really rise all the way to the front rank? He never really got a chance, I suppose.

[Marcus]

Completely agree, Alex, but "indisputably great" and "indisputably major" are two completely different things...I don't think there's ever been an "indisputably great" conductor of any age. There are always detractors!

[Boycott Vienna]

Carlos Kleiber had, by the age of 50, done his deathless Brahms 4 AND the Beethoven 5 and Beethoven 7. As well as Die Fledermaus, AND Die Freischuetz. All of them first choice recordings for the respective works. No mean feat!

I'm sure there were detractors, but no one who would have been taken seriously.

But Kleiber--a total genius, and eccentric to the core--might be the exception that proves Alex's rule.

(But now, I also think of Zubin Mehta who was, incredibly, only six years younger than Kleiber, and who is not too shabby as conductors go).

[Marcus]

Yes, both Kleiber's were already "indisputably major" by the time they reached 55, but I purposely tried to leave out conductors who lived far past that point, unless they are still alive and younger than 55.

As for Mehta, I love his old Decca recordings (especially the stellar ones made with the LA Phil and his Turandot), and I think his Alpine Symphony on Sony is a great read, but haven't been impressed with much from him since the mid-1990s.

[Scott Spiegelberg]

I saw a great performance of Mahler's Second with Mehta leading the CSO at Ravinia, back in '93. But to the matter at hand, I think we need a good definition of "major" before we can settle the question. (And I agree with Alex that it is great to see your return to blogging.)

[Alex Ross]

Yes, Kleiber is an exception, and so too is Arthur Nikisch, probably. But, really, I meant this comment more as a playful quip than as an adamantine assertion of fact. Ah, the perils of mild irony!

[Andrew]

I very much appreciate that Zubin Mehta Alpine Symphony on Sony, too. I thought that I was the only person on the planet who liked that particular reading, so I am happy to learn at last that I am not alone. I was beginning to believe that it was merely an inexplicable personal quirk on my part.

On an old and out-of-date matter, everything you wrote earlier about the horns and strings of the Dresden Staatskapelle was spot on. In fact, I believe that the Dresden orchestra is the best orchestra in German-speaking countries.

[Louise]

What about Leonard Bernstein and
Pierre Boulez?

[Marcus]

What about Boulez and Bernstein? As I wrote in a previous comment: "I purposely tried to leave out conductors who lived far past that point [the age of 50-60], unless they are still alive and younger than 55." Both have/had "indisputedly major" careers. (Although in Boulez's case, I think his conducting has decreased in quality as his compositions have increased in quality. His recent "From the House of the Dead" in Amsterdam is an exception...)